Sophie Gregory is a dairy farmer in Dorset, and over the years her thousands of followers - all 12k of them - have followed her on her journey into agriculture. Not from farming, she called herself 'farmer in training' and has used her platform to talk about farming, milk and her life as an organic Arla dairy farmer.
This year she has become a Nuffield Scholar, opting to research the organic milk market. In this Farmers Guardian podcast episode, online editor Emily Ashworth talks to Sophie all about her upcoming travels, her passion for the dairy industry and how we can look forward to a sustainable farming future.
Sophie Gregory is a dairy farmer in Dorset, and over the years her thousands of followers - all 12k of them - have followed her on her journey into agriculture. Not from farming, she called herself 'farmer in training' and has used her platform to talk about farming, milk and her life as an organic Arla dairy farmer.
This year she has become a Nuffield Scholar, opting to research the organic milk market. In this Farmers Guardian podcast episode, online editor Emily Ashworth talks to Sophie all about her upcoming travels, her passion for the dairy industry and how we can look forward to a sustainable farming future.
Hear that? That's the sound of your farm business growing. Tree planting can work hand-in-hand with food production, help restore nature, and you can even generate extra income to build the future of your business, your land and the environment. With a woodland creation grant and receive free expert advice to start your tree planting journey. Find out how your business can branch out such woodland creation today. Grants are for England only. Terms and conditions apply. You're listening to the Farmer's Guardian podcast. Hello and welcome to this week's Farmers Guardian podcast episode. I am very excited to say that this week I'm talking to the wonderful Sophie Gregory. you may know her by her Instagram account, a farmer in training. She's well known for many things, but Sophie's main passion is dairy, an organic dairy farmer based in Dorset. She's proud to represent champion British Dairy, and she was also dairy industry woman of the Year 2021. Her next adventure awaits imminently, though, as she embarks on her Nuffield Scholarship. Looking into the future of organic dairy. So I really hope you enjoy this conversation with me. Emily Ashworth, Afg's online editor and the ever inspiring Sophie Gregory. Right. So like I said, Sophie, it's super Talk to you. Finally, we finally got in the diary. Do you want to just tell me a little bit about your background? Because actually, I don't know a lot about where you're from or if you're from a farming background yourself. Yeah, course. So, yeah, I'm from at the moment on the Dorset Devon border and then Lyme Regis and we're organic and we've been here in ten years, which is Matt and I'm not from an ag background and are kids quite young and I probably would have gone to university. That wasn't really an option. So I ended up training to be an accountant. And because I can do that alongside having Harry, my youngest and my oldest, even the youngest one. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And we yes, we were wearing calves we can wear for the RSPCA standard stuff with a business partner. And then we approached them about taking on a share farming agreement on a dairy farm, which is about an hour from where we were living. And so we did that ten years ago and the answer is no to begin with is no, we're not interested. And then we was quite persistent with it and he and he agreed to have a look at it. And there's quite a lot people interested. And then, yeah, then we got it. We never thought we would, but yes, it was 575 acres. And really the only reason that organic originally was that the numbers, the best out, the systems we ran. So it was actually not a choice to be organic and within like from the heart choice, it was definitely a financial choice at the time. The milk price and the difference between conventional and organic was just it was worth doing. Yeah. So we went down that route that buildings have only really got enough of up to 400 milking cows, but with the amount of land, it's more than enough. Yeah. So we kind of note 500 something cows. So it just suited what we had. And actually over time the farm has it just feels so organic. It's just it's quite a wild farm. It's quite a and there's not a lot of nature here already. They just eat organic. Yeah, it's quite low input. Yeah. So is your husband from farming? Are you both out. Both Well, it's interesting with Tom because he his dad sold the cows when he was 1011 and then went clamming. So he. Yeah, he and his mum was well she didn't really want him to get back farming. I don't think he did engineering college and then he was cattle foot trimming for eight years before we came to the farm. So he was in agriculture but he wasn't actually farming. And when from when I met him, really when I was 17, 18, he'd always wanted to go back farming, dairy farming. And I was totally like, no way, I didn't want to do this. Like, I just absolutely fetch quite a well-paid job if you do it. And it's definitely back breaking and it's but and it's piecework. It's McCaffery, really. And so we had quite a come to when I started. I wasn't really like willing to risk it. I was so young children didn't really know. I had no idea about it. So I was sort of, yeah, I was very hesitant. And then in the end I was like, What we've got to lose, you know, let's do it. So yeah, I wasn't going to be involved in a farmer too soon with, but it just the cows got out one day and I was the only one to convince the cows. And then I was like this. Now look at you like little. I have had so many achievements as well. Like I was just having to look again before, like, and you obviously do a lot of things, you know, in terms of education. And you were the one the woman in what, Women in Dairy Award 2021. Yeah, right. And now you're embarking on a Nuffield scholarship. That's quite crazy actually, to look back. Maybe, you know, for someone who is from a non farming background and then have kind of, you know, a little bit of passion along the way. Yeah. I mean, I can't imagine doing anything else before in the morning because nothing else about that. So that time for. Yeah exactly. But actually it really does off the back. I like it. We got quite a young team. I just said would you rather be working in office. We doing something different every day? Not today. We've been wearing heifers and we're doing a couple of lame cows and then in the cars that are on holiday for milking as well. It's all different that we're doing something different, especially when the cows go out as well. They get a bit easier and yeah, things got a bit easier and it's just a different yet different flow of farming with so probably farm alongside the seasons quite a lot. So yeah, it changes every day what we're doing. So it's, I think it's a great career and she's really well paid. It's actually really it can be really well paid for someone who's employed on a farm. You'll forget how people underestimate that, I think. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Do you want to just talk us through that and let you systems on farm, like how many cows you bring in and kind of how you approach your farming systems and, and you said before, I think you use the term this sounds quite wild. Like what do you do in terms of not the environment on the farm. Yeah. So we're as let's say people say like, you're spring carver, but we're basically we've got two thirds of the cows calve in the in the spring is really going to be nearly 300 this spring and then 100 the autumn. And originally we planned just to be spring but we had really bad to see in the first year where we bought cows from a lot of different places. So we, we ended up keeping the second lot of cows gotten back in calf. We were going to sell them, but went up the second block, so we calf eight weeks in the spring and nine weeks in the autumn. All the young stock. So all of the heifers, the replacements caught in the spring, in the first ten days and sexy months. And then so they calving at 24, 23, 24 months old. And then the the autumn had it's just beef and I treat treated all the same. You know they come in at the same time but they're fed a bit more through your part of a part from that run as one herd and we graze normally up until totally weather dependent but normally by day until beginning of November. And then we can still go out for another month at night, that day even. And then by night we would be in 1st of December, we'd be in full time. And then we know we've turned out we've had a few days here and there out and but it we just had a lot of rain in the last seven days. So we're back in full time. But ground now it's start turning out. So 4 hours a day depending on what we've what grass we've got round. So we're really grazing focus. We don't we're not we haven't really got the infrastructure, I mean we've got good infrastructure, but our type of cow like to be outside. That's what the bread for desert for 500 kilo cow, Irish Friesian and Amy, two days of five, five and a half thousand liters and of about between 800 and a tonne of concentrate so that yeah they're pretty efficient at turning grass to milk because their biggest thing and they've got good feet that's what we're breeding for and Tennessee as well And we in terms of the environment I suppose we, I mean not everyone now with SFI, we've been growing quite well, but just, just because of that little organic, we don't, we can't use nitrogen of sea. So we've been using a lot clay this for a long time because it really help and not only grow, grow good quality grass and silage and, but also they're really good for the soil just to have some diversity in that. So I've been doing that for a while. Some soil might say he he's he's the one that does most of the field works from we grow and we don't really get anything else but grass on the home farm. We've got an arable farm as well now which he's grown. Yeah, yeah. The long term goal of the arable farm is to have that back to the home farm. So that will then replace the concentrates. So try and create a circular system where we're in control of all of the inputs into it which is along. Yeah, it should be good. Organic concentrates are really a really expensive, quite volatile price wise and also quite hard to source, quite good quality if that makes sense. You can get them, but you know you're not in control of that really. So we just want to try and be in control of that. So we took that on last year and then we'll get back to Grace and that of course he silage and the other things we do in terms of nature, we sit on a seven year cycle with our hedges now and not selling them every year as part of when somebody saying, Hey, get coffee on a cycle some late plant, at least a hundred meters of hedgerow. Yeah, we're just yeah, we're trying to remember that most definitely not most animal species like a different hatch. So different. So there's something for everyone on the farm really. And B, I say we've got bees on the farm. The gardener. And he's actually left now. But he, he was helping me a lot with the base. So he's, he had to leave the farm and I'm hoping the new garden and won't be into that day for the main. So it's a big estate where we are and then that landlords and gardener was always really into the base, so we just put them on the right way where he goes, the best place. And that's pretty help with pollinating and of our and things. And then we've had hunting back for them and it's just like even my middle school he really loves going out that but yeah we're just trying to be we're not plants we try not to plow that much which is it's been stitching in as much as we can. We do pound the arable to reset every seven years but it's quite, it's quite a help when plowing with organic because it's actually quite useful too. So it is part of the tool, but we don't have much in the tool box being organic, but it is actually one of the things we can use. So yeah, we're just, we're just trying to work with nature as much as possible. I think this farm, that's what it lends itself to. It's quite wet at the bottom of a nice bit of green sand through the middle and then it can dry up over talk, say we are lucky in that way. Some of it doesn't grow a lot across and we use those bits from rearing a bit beef and then some breakfast to the farm. We just trying to use bits that st animals we got on farm. So, so you know, I'm just going back to what you were saying on your Instagram. Let me get it back up. Okay. So you know, they graze and obviously have an all a dairy farm, so which I never say farming pilot network. Is that something that you're all part of? Yeah. So and they are The weekend pilot was set up in olive were wanted to explore the space of region and what it meant to dairy farmers without going out of greenwashing or they want to start to explore it with their farmers. So it's it has to be farmer that's really it's the owners of the co-operative so we and also it's a European collective. So whatever we do, the UK, we need to do and the other countries do so. And there are eight farms in the UK that are all trialing different things. So, so we make up what we made up at least as a group for a twice a year and then as a European group another once a year. And then we have a monthly catch up and we all have our own handprint plants and things we are trialing on farm. So the one hit my husband's leading one, which is on composting. So we just trialing what impacts we can have with composting our farm avenue rather than just yeah, just using slurry. So he's he's doing that and it's it's we're hoping at the end of the period I could buy the a project that we all then feedback our ideas back to the membership and then they can embrace them and trial them. And as as part of it's not just an organic there's that half as organic off of conventional. So this is too there's two house farms on there as well. So it's sort of like saying how what we are means to house dairy to an organic to extensive grazed autumn calving spring calving we around. So yeah it's definitely yeah, it's definitely sort of like no one really knew what direction we're going to take at the beginning, but we've all had very much the same which way it goes, which has been great and that's really nice. And also pharmacies done much better from each other. Yeah, yeah. Farmer Farm is probably the best way to learn and what you might work hard at. Exactly. And what might work. It might not work to another farm because we've got different land, different different cows, different and yeah, totally different setups and systems. I think that's really important actually, because, you know, when you look at what's happening with SFI in Wales, for example, and Scotland, you know, it can't be a one size fits all approach. It just just doesn't make sense. No three schools in it, it's farming is such a devout even in dairy farming, there's there's real diversity in agriculture. But then we spread that across in dairy and even and then if you spread that across beef, sheep, arable, you know, all of them, you can, you know, we've got such different types of farming in the UK, so it's just exploring things that won't work for one farm, might not work for another, but we can share ideas. Yeah. And you know, if you kind of, if you stick along that along the lines of that knowledge knowledge exchange between farmers, you know, you can, you can pick and choose kind of elements of the farms that, you know, might be able to tweak your business. The output, quite a significant change doesn't have to be out of the whole business to say no. And I think the thing with region is it's not like I don't think it is a standard. I think it's like principles, you know, it doesn't need to be a standard. I don't think it needs to be organic and needs to just be people can just choose what suits their business. You know, most people getting fed up with the wet as well now because, you know, agri food companies saying that region I mean even is region but if it if it gets someone to adjust something that doing in a positive way to their farming system and the environment then it can only be a win I think. And also it's got really people excited about food and farming again. So kind of, you know, that must be a win win. Yeah, yeah, that definitely am. Okay, so let's talk about your Nuffield Scholarship. It's really exciting and a lot of people say, you know, this is something I think Emma I said this actually correct me if I'm wrong, is it something that you've always wanted to do, but you just never quite found, I mean, completely understandable with three children and the farm business, would you not found the time to do it? Exactly. I would probably want to do it for about five years, and it was never really the right time. But I think we were told, actually, you get you do enough when you're busy, but actually that's your time to do so I just don't need the confidence to apply. Come on. And I didn't really have a topic I was passionate about and a lot of people would say very much so about the topic. It's about the person. But I actually thought if I can spend 18 months exploring and then I would need to be really passionate about this and I see something that's going to be impactful to the industry as well as our business. So when I was like, you know, we're really struggling as organic dairy farmers. Consumer doesn't really understand what organic means of region and it doesn't really, you know, doesn't really warrant than paying extra on shelf. They're confused by what they're actually paying in conventional is really caught up with organic in terms of standards and things but it looks totally different in other countries. So how do we how do we bring some of that back to the UK and get organic really going again? And so, yeah, it's I'm so excited. I mean, I'm like, yeah, we've got our first bit, which is a CSA, which is basically all of the Nuffield International Foods gets together in one country in a conference for a week. So we've got that in about three weeks time to say that's in Brazil, say, Yeah, I'm totally nervous, but I'm really excited. Everyone's in the same, same situation, so that would be great. And then I think that's very much what we're doing at the start. And then you meet people that you would then go and get to travel alongside or go and visit different countries. You sort of have to put a slight plan together when you apply of which countries you should go for. And my big ones were Sri Lanka and Taiwan and India. So shrink is a bit of an interesting one because they brought organic policy overnight in and it just totally, wow destroyed the economy. So they they have no knowledge of farming organically so they just removed they were subsidizing fertilizer quite hard as well. So people were using it quite, quite heavily and it just destroyed their economy. It caused riots and fetuses and things. So it's the obvious one to go and see where it went wrong. Like if you're going to bring in policy around organic, there has to be some knowledge exchange and things and it needs to graduate. Can't just be overnight. And India's got a huge volume of organic and some of that is because they're small scale and that they're not they want to farm the way they farm. And if some of them have only got ten cows and they've always farmed organically, Taiwan is like 25% organic already. They've got huge policy around getting to 50% organic and they are heavily subsidized to be organic, but there's not really a market for the organic produce. It sort of ending off the mainstream, but they say basically, see, organic is the environmental solution. The government are quite happy to subsidize it and they're quite full thinking country. So it's it's an interesting one. And then I will go to America as well because organic dairy over that means quite a lot different to the UK. Yeah. And also you can call something organic without being fairly organic. So if you had a pizza with like an amount of organic produce on it, then you could call it organic. There's different, there's different rules around it. So I'm definitely going to go to America probably in June-July time and they've got huge organic crops of cool organic barley and and a lot of that. So try to accept that producers are Amish. So I'm going to go and spend some time with the Amish today. They only about 20% of their food. But then the life that 82% of meat it so that very small farms, really very small farms and they have to work alongside. I always have to be thinking of God for that very small, very small, very, very much done by hand. So it would be a totally different organic means, hugely different things over that to here. So it would be very exciting. Like when I go shopping and I've got really good sponsors, I've got train tracks to my sponsor and they're a dairy sponsor, so they sponsor normally two a year. And so we've got I've got another method to my sponsored by train and they're looking at and they're he's a Welsh chap who is lovely and he, he's looking at sort of entrepreneurship in dairy farming. So like getting into dairy farm, he's not from a dairy background. So he's, he's looking at so basically attracting the next generation. And so he's, yeah, he's doing it on that. So they've, they've sponsored too, which is great. And we get a mentor from train as well, so often a train scholar as well. So they've done it already and they can give you a school thing and then Nuffield could be a sponsor as well and a mentor as well, say Nancy along the way and a few friends have done one and they said, you know, if you segment your business and you're looking for challenges, you absolutely should do it and say, I'm definitely encouraging everyone to apply. He's thinking about it. And I think the applications are even open for this year. The idea around the year 2025. Yes, they are. Yeah. Can you just and you know, what's your actual title of you'll Nuffield scholar. Yeah. So mine is and what's the future for organic dairy farming. So we're we're pretty stagnant in milk sales you actually felt that back with COVID and with cost of living etcetera. And and I think the consumer in the UK most apart from knowing that it doesn't doesn't use fertilizers and chemicals, apart from that, you don't really understand what they're getting with buying organic. So it's trying to look at other countries which are getting the messaging right and we'll say our policies. Is it because of policy that that organic driving in some countries say, you know, Denmark and Sweden have had a really successful organic dairy place and they you know, it was huge, huge amounts of organic veggies going back a bit, but they still have huge policy agendas. On being organic to their aim is that extent of organic produce on the land by 2030, and that's Denmark and they've got 60% of the service has to be organic and in Denmark. So it's they hate that. Then that leads back to people buying at home. And also when interested in me, they have in, in things that were in the Audi unit or any of the budget shops, they have like a budget range, organic, like mid-range, organic and high end organic. So it's all it's very accessible. Whereas in the UK it's normally out and premium brands and it's how we as shoppers associate organic with actually being a premium brand. So I think that puts people off. They think it's not for them. And so it's like making it more accessible for all basically. And so association are doing a huge thing. On making organic accessible for all this. Yeah, that said, that's messaging and that branding and I will be primarily looking at organic dairy that I am running from what industry to do. Well say if chicken's doing well in one country, why is it is it is it the people are actually involved in marketing products or is actually that the conventional option is way less. So they just they, they use it as a welfare standard. So yeah, that's, that's my topic. They say it's as much about the person the journey so but the topic not to address where where I'm going to go and I'm not sure I'll solve it in the 18 months but I think hopefully bringing back some yeah some ideas that we can use in the UK for the organic industry. Absolutely. And I think it's that whole consumer conversation is, is so interesting because well there's so many parts of conversations within one conversation for a start, because it's not just you can't just tackle one part and then, you know, it's a domino effect. But that whole idea of having different sections of society who are almost entitled, if you will, to buy one sort of brand or food, I'm crazy, isn't it? It's like, you know, how do we step? Because it's true if you do when you are talking about food and and I had a conversation with a food writer years and years ago and and what she said always stayed with me. And it's like this there's like class associations attached to you when you buy food. And that's just not right. And you can't have that. No. And you don't see it in other countries. You don't see it in Denmark. Denmark doesn't have that similar culture and that sort of societal culture, whereas in the UK we very much have that and that just put people off buying. Yes, the price is price morbid and it would put them off because they think of it as yes, as paid for posh people. So just using them all they do on some it guarantees grazing. You know, if you buy organic milk that cow has to have grazed proportionately, which isn't the case where on some of the milks there is, you know there is the guarantee but not all. And if that's important to them, then then that's you know, the messaging should be around that. Yeah. And there's also that you touched on it before about, you know, the different sort of labeling systems, if you will. Like if in America a certain portion of that product is from an organic farm, then you can label it is organic. So I would be really interested to see what you find out there because, you know, we can have the same with meat, for example, here dealt with that in a pact in the UK can be things and it is so confusing. So yeah, and let's talk about education then for a little bit because I know that you do a lot with the education side of things. You have you have children coming on farm, don't you. Is that right? Yeah. So yeah, so we had school visits here and, and we just had a school, which is farm and protective landscape. So if we're an area of outstanding natural beauty, then there's access to funds which called support, which is farming. Yeah. Probably protected landscapes. And you can apply for grants up to a certain percentage of projects that will have a positive impact to the environment and society around them. So we went for a federal grant to support us with our classroom. So we've got some old buildings here. So that's three, three panels and a and a old office that we want to convert into a classroom. Because when we have school visits and it takes two two teachers to take them to the loo because it's not the right, you've got one loo in the house down by the door. And also if it's wet and cold outside, we know it's difficult that these some of these kids aren't used to being outside. So it's like having somewhere that's warm and when they can have their lunch and things and then so we've just been awarded a 50% grant towards that, which is great. And then we we've gone out for funding to private sources as well. So hopefully the class will be done. This year and we've got planning and everything for the instructors. So that's really exciting. And then we also see that classroom. So like farmers farmer meetings, we farm walks and things on farm and just having a meeting. I'm very happy having them in the house space and it'll be nice to have a space outside and you know, and that our team can use as well for team learning and stuff like that. So it become a bit of a hub, hub of the farm. But yeah, I think it's very important. The kids especially, you know, where they're feeds from, but also to know that agriculture can be a career for them if they haven't actually come to me. You know, my, you know, I'd had no idea I could be a farmer when I was younger. There's no way. I mean, I had this little Lynette. My mum was a vet, but I never I never knew I could actually go and farming. I thought, you know, it's just if you're your grandpa, your dad or your mom was in farming then. Yeah, but no, apart from that I didn't think. Yeah. I didn't think you could have an opportunity is as much about that and that learning from and offering it as a good career in the future. Them interestingly I was talking to your fellow Nuffield scholar DUNS next this morning. Yeah. And he's also very excited about you all are going to have a wonderful time and but we were talking about you know that's exactly you've hit the nail on the head in terms of, you know, how do we well, going back to what we said about how you make food choices and what exemptions are like, we have to get to we have to get to children because we need that longevity of, you know, talking to them while they're young so they can obviously grow well with that knowledge. Well, in terms of careers, 100%, because and we're basically saying, you know, that if you I don't know if a farmer gave his time to all their time to openly kind of welcome students on work experience and students, and then he put all this hard work in and they don't realize that they don't have kind of the knowledge behind them that this is what it is. And then they go after six months, you kind of feel like you've wasted your time. So we need to get like that longevity. Like I say, that longevity of knowledge in these kids and students just to really, like get them involved and open ourselves up to them. And I don't think we can do that unless we get to kids really, really early. I think you're really right, Emily. And I think and I think it is a bigger thing than just about what's going in their minds. It's about the health of the country as well. Like so many people are obese now and, you know, health conditions. But some of these things, you can start the route for some of this is doctor. And some of this could be changed by understanding way of foods from learning how to cook a good meal. Healthy meal doesn't have to be an expensive meal. Yeah, I mean, what could be more important than feeding ourself? It's just a real opening up. Well, yeah. So. Yeah. And some of these kids, you know, I don't The education system now isn't set up for every child. No, they're not going to the teachers when they come here and they bring that and bring some of the kids that do best at ones that have really struggled in mainstream, you know, they just really struggle to sit in a classroom and they are so happy on the food. Yeah. And that's and that's what you know, that is so great. And the thank you letters we get. And it just makes it really worthwhile. And even when we have the same cross back again, they, you know, they still remember that year before they see love it. Yeah. And we've got a really good charity called Discover Farming, which is a lot of local land agents at all landowners even put money into this fund every year, and it sponsors scholarships for people who want to go and study agriculture at uni or having a year out and want to do, you know, maybe their course practicals or whatever. And then we also put on a big event at a couple of local shows. So we bring a milking cow and one World Cup actually now and then someone brings brings their wool to be spun. There's an apple. Apple grows that will make apple juice smoothie by everyone brings their own thing huge tent focused around theme and Chris and I and they people yeah when you come just for that school of farming and it's just a great it's just great Kristie as well to be part of Apple and it's all voluntary and everyone gives that time but with huge benefit. You know, we've had people come and join the farm off the back of it and it's just, you know, it's just a really exciting projects that we have and it just makes it all together. So you were saying before as well, right at the beginning of the conversation, do you say you have quite a big team there? Yeah, I mean, we've got quite a young team and quite a bit, yeah, quite big spaces and with quite a lot of people part time. So to get part time is to one to heartbreak. So she comes on Saturday, she comes home at weekends and let's say she's actually an uncle has it. She lives on the farm, but her uncle has robots and she wants to learn how to milk and she's great. Erin And then we've got Carol. He's at Kingston Woods, another college down the road. She she comes three days a week, sort of every other weekend. And then two days in the week she's doing level three agriculture. And then I've got my full time girl who's 20, lives on the farm she's from. She was actually just washing up in a pub. She's been with us two years. And when I'm not here, she's in charge of the cows. She's really fantastic. And and then Sam does not track to up. He's been with us. Probably with them. The three days is just about to be 90. And it's like a work experience with us. Then it is his good luck at weekend job with us. And then he did apprenticeship with us. They've been with this quite a while now, but he does a lot on track to work. We've taken quite a bit in-house now, so he's able to be busy most of the year, which is which is good. And I mean to oversee things. I run the cows and pretty much everything else. Yeah. So that the arable does between a lot to do the stock and then everyone has to be looking at the cows that day so everyone knows how to make the cows. Sam knows how to move the cows out. Everyone does say that if something happens that anyone could get in them. And also we just trying to remember why we're doing it. You know, the cows are the most important thing on the farm. Say, yeah, the tractors, you know, might be a bit fun, but they, you know, the cows are the important thing and they pay those. Yeah. And in terms of, you know, social media, obviously, you've got a hefty following behind you now. I think it's up to 12,000 on Instagram now, if I've got that right. I mean, I definitely going to TV a lot. And is that, you know, what does what does that enable you to do, do you think? Because you do put very educational posts out there which which I think is great and I mean, it almost feels as if it has to be like part of your job now to tell your story, which isn't necessarily bad, but if you enjoy it and that's fine. And I think if you feel like you're connecting to people, which can kind of, I suppose, go back to what you were saying in terms of allowing consumers to actually see. But, you know, being organic means behind the light, definitely behind that bottle of milk. I think for me, I just started doing it to share. I didn't know how long ago it was. Now, maybe six years ago. I and to yeah, just to share the story behind Dairy Farm because I was new into it and I thought every time I was getting some, I thought, my goodness, no one knows this. I no one knows actually how much work goes behind that, You know, Very pretty cheap. Pretty cheap drink, really. So I started I started sharing it. I stopped for a bit and a lot of my friends were like, No, we really love seeing the cows. So I kept going with that and I do enjoy doing it. And some days I'm like, I don't really feel like doing it. So day and then I've just got it's probably 5050 of people who follow me that are farmers and we share ideas and I learn a lot from them. And then we've got the others. Are just the consumers actually just really interested where their food is from and it become more, you know, more useful as we sell a of beef directly. And probably three members of my staff come from social media just like, you know, they've just known known who we are. And it's yeah, it definitely helped. It definitely has helped connect me to the right people as well as I've had some amazing opportunities that I probably wouldn't have had if I hadn't have shared our story. And I, you know, my my hand, it was never meant to be a sort of, you know, something to get people to follow. But I definitely I think we're family just forever learning every day. Something is a school days and it you just never know. So I'm on the phone or in training but I think that someone said, you should change that. So, you know, train farmers. I guess it makes I'm literally planning every day I train, you know, what we need regulation and everything changes all the time. Say it's hard to keep up with the whole thing. So yeah, just share for fun. And I've always said that if I don't enjoy it any more, I'll stop doing it and that. But you know, it's not it's not an income thing or anything like that. It's literally just sharing what we do here on farm. I mean, I saw the one this morning which was about the Sugarloaf was the live half term. Yeah. And I was I feel that I really feel that I save money and I've got I think I've got really I've got up it's only really one milking at the moment. So at least it's only just over 120 and we've got about 300 calves in the next two and eight week while we've got another couple weeks before we start the family. So we tried a lot of cows dry basically on holiday, eight weeks off the full calving. And so it's only really one of us needs to milk and luckily my main girls like she's you know I have to fight her out the pit if she's in the morning So we we together a couple of mornings a week just to keep an eye on the cows. But I'm still awake So so for this morning came downstairs so I'll read a bit, do the accounts etc. And then like about 45 minutes after I've been downstairs, I was picked up after and I think all and I don't really want to be cross about them coming away, but I was like, This is my time. But again, I was just I really bad. But I just it's like I'm trying to carve that time before the day stop because I knew I had a busy morning when I have this. So I just yeah, it's how is the juggle? Always a juggle, but a fun juggle. I don't think I'd have it any other way. And so let's, let's finish on AM I just really love the idea that you probably just had no idea that you were going to end up where you are. So and have you know and the one thing that I like is that thinking that I have all these new and I've been at it for ten years now, and I just love thinking of all the things that I've found different passions for, whether that's soil. Like I never thought I would be so interested in soil and well, I just, you know, me meeting all these people, like there's so many opportunities and so many things that you like, you say you just don't know about unless you've experienced it in the industry. So what is it that you and what is it that you love about what you do? And you can kind of reflect on what you've done to get to this point? I think probably I just like how different every day is, you know, like really I actually struggle and we slow down for like this period of time when we're milking cows and we shoot is a natural time to have a bit of a break. Probably should have arrived. I told my skiing last week actually because of the great good farmers and our customers who aren't busy in the I'm that I just I find I really enjoy it when you know when you're out of frame and something's calving is quite exciting and you know I love I love the adrenalin I also like the routine of of milking really the headspace of milk I guess with the cows. It's amazing. Time to think. We get my best ideas. Yeah, but also the people in the industry, you know, there's just such a great group of they're very supportive and there's some amazing men and women coming through the industry now. I just don't think it's been as exciting as this for a long time. Yeah. And I think it, you know, it's hard work. I can't get around. That is tiring. And there are days and I think, my goodness, what am I doing? But 99% of the time I love my job. And I think, yeah, I'm I love that my favorite time of year is when I'm getting up and it's light and it just starts in the day with the sunrise and it's just there's nothing more rewarding of being outside. I just don't think I could be in an office full time now. So it's it's forever learning as well. That's another thing. Using my brain forever learning and just the diversity of every day is different. Definitely. That would be my summarizing is that every day is different on the fly. We never really know what's around the corner. Yeah, till we are sending Sophie lots of look. As she sets out to research her scholarship, Nuffield scholarships are actually now open for 2025, so head over to the Nuffield farming website for more info. It's a really fantastic opportunity to delve into whatever you're passionate about. That's it for me this week. Pharmacology. And we'll go back again next week with another fantastic episode, so please make sure you subscribe on your favorite platform.